Real Housewives on Real Housewives
Heather brought us Mormon Nancy Drew this season… unearthing secret Instagram accounts and maybe finally solving the case of the black eye?
In this episode, we discuss Heather Gay storylines from Real Housewives of Salt Lake City season 4:
⚪Heather vs Lisa ⚪Heather vs Monica around Beauty Lab ⚪Heather vs Black eye
Sharon: We’re going to go over Heather’s second book titles. Okay.
Caitlin: What do you think she’s going to call?
Sharon: Well, the funny thing is, I was like, what was her first book title? It’s bad Mormon. So this is what I came up with. Okay.
Caitlin: I, only have one bad Mormon.
Sharon: Well, mine are kind of dumb. Okay, good Heathen. Oh, I like good Heathen, good sinner, or queen of outer darkness.
Caitlin: Oh, I like queen of outer darkness. Although that sounds like a Sci-Fi book.
Sharon: It does.
Caitlin: I have bad housewife.
Sharon: Oh, perfect. I love it. That’s perfect.
Caitlin: And I don’t think she can name it Lisa Barlow, Mormon. That’s, the other.
Sharon: No, that is. I love it. Hi. This is Caitlin, and this is Sharon.
Caitlin: And welcome to Real Housewives on Real Housewives, where we unravel housewives story threads and keep the tea flowing.
Sharon: So chic.
Caitlin: Hold on to your snowflake.
Sharon: This week, we’re digging into Heather gay from Real Housewives of Salt Lake City, season four.
Caitlin: The verses this week for Heather are, Heather versus Lisa, Heather versus Monica with a beauty lab focus. And Heather versus black eye. Still not done with that. We thought we were done last time. Coming back. All right, Heather gay owns beauty lab and is an author. Go listen to our Bad Mormon podcast, because we really enjoyed the book, even though at the time, we were kind of annoyed at Heather. So I think that says a lot about the book.
Sharon: Yeah.
Caitlin: Did you know she’s a New York Times bestselling author?
Sharon: I did, and actually, I appreciate her. Her book is really, really good.
Caitlin: She does well written. she’s divorced from her Mormon royalty ex husband, and she’s divorced from the church of Mormon, and she has three daughters. we go back and forth on Heather. I love Heather. I hate Heather. I love Heather. I hate Heather.
Sharon: I was hate Heather in the beginning, and now I love Heather.
Caitlin: Me too.
Sharon: I don’t know what happens.
Caitlin: Yeah, well, it’s kind of funny, because coming out of the book for the beginning of the season, I thought I’d go into the season being like, yes, Heather. And then I was kind of like, she’s not really bringing it as much. And then at the end, of course, it’s like, yes, go, Heather. So she’s funny. She’s a pendulum for us. All right, let’s talk about Heather versus Lisa. So the background information on this is that Lisa’s son, Jack is going on a mission, and this triggers Heather. So she’s distanced herself from mormonism, and it’s distanced itself from her. and she hasn’t left the Mormon church like Whitney, which I kind of keep forgetting. She hasn’t made the official, she hasn’t sent in the facts.
Sharon: Is it just that letter or whatever?
Caitlin: Mormon.com or whatever. Wasn’t it a website?
Sharon: Yeah.
Caitlin: but it’s like, ah, her mormon stepford wife triggers.
Sharon: She’s also, but then she also gets upset that Lisa kind of doesn’t talk about Jack with her.
Caitlin: Which she wants it both.
Sharon: She does, and I kind of understand how she feels. But she can’t have it both ways. Exactly.
Caitlin: I think she kind of thinks of herself as like the Mormon Encyclopedia of the group. Yes, but she’s also the most anti of the group because Whitney is. But she doesn’t throw it in your face as much as Heather does.
Sharon: Yeah. Well, I can kind of see how Heather feels like, you know what, I am the Mormon expert. Let me tell you, you don’t understand because you don’t even go into the main temple and you’ve never been on a mission. So I think that’s why she wants so much, because she is more of an authority than Lisa.
Caitlin: What’s funny is, so, okay, I put the question, is this fair? Like, is it fair that it triggers her? And I think it makes sense that it triggers her. I don’t think it’s fair necessarily that she puts it on Lisa. The interesting thing to me is that Heather spends so much time protecting her own daughters, like their choices and what they want to do and them going out against the norm and doing their things and living their own life and making their own mistakes. Like she keeps saying, I want them to go out and live in the world and experience all the things. And then she has the opposite feeling about Jack, which I think is really interesting because that’s not really fair to have it cut both ways like that.
Sharon: That’s a really good point.
Caitlin: Yeah, I think that, I just think she kind of needs to think about how it looks from the other way, which is hard to see. I’m sure Heather’s, really curious about it, too. So I also think there’s kind of that element of not being in on the t that really upsets, don’t think.
Sharon: I think it’s almost because, remember how she missed the community and m, it’s like before, this is like a community thing that she would have got to talk about and celebrate, and now she’s not part of it anymore. And I think it’s just another time that she’s excluded now.
Caitlin: Yes, I think that’s absolutely true. Because when you think about, it’s like if everyone in your friend group is doing something or getting something, and even though it’s like you wouldn’t begrudge anybody any of that happiness or any of that joy, there’s a party that’s like, I’m not part of it, too. And I think that’s exactly what she’s feeling, especially when she feels like, you.
Sharon: Guys don’t understand how bad this is. Right.
Caitlin: And the fact that she thinks that Lisa, and this I kind of get from sort of how I am as a. Like, Heather’s always played by the rules. She talks about that a lot in her book. I did the thing. I was a good Mormon.
Caitlin: And then all of a sudden, it’s like I played by all the rules and I still failed. Like, I still didn’t win, I still didn’t get what I wanted out of. I didn’t play the game right. And then she sees Lisa over here and she’s playing the game completely wrong. She’s not following the rules, and she’s getting what Heather didn’t get out of it.
Sharon: That’s interesting.
Caitlin: That sucks. That wouldn’t feel good to Heather.
Sharon: It’s because Lisa’s more confident, doesn’t care.
Caitlin: And also, I think because she doesn’t have to wear the garments, I’d be really mad about that. If I’d spent my whole life having.
Sharon: To wear that, I would not be happy.
Caitlin: It’s probably scratchy, too.
Sharon: Oh, God. Oh, God. I would have to leave.
Caitlin: I mean, I would be like, if.
Sharon: It had a allergy, can I get an exemption? I need, like a seamless.
Caitlin: Do you have a strapless one? I can’t do the strap.
Sharon: So I have a question. How would you feel if your kids became very religious and wanted to go on some kind of mission?
Caitlin: That’s an excellent question. Because I really am big on, like, this is your path and you need to follow. Just because I like it or just.
Sharon: Because I want you to do it.
Caitlin: Doesn’T mean you have to do it. But the religion thing is hard because you grow up having a certain belief and you think your kids have that same belief. And then if you find out that they have a different belief, that’s really hard. And especially because I think you have to have so much faith for this part of the step. So if your kid is going on it, I can see being supportive of them. But then for you not to have that faith component behind it, that would be a little terrifying.
Sharon: I agree.
Caitlin: I’m also kind of in not a great personal place with religion in general. I just have some feelings, some feels. I kind of feel like Heather about.
Sharon: It a little bit.
Caitlin: So it would be hard for me too.
Sharon: It would be really hard for me. It would upset me. Yeah, I know that sounds bad. It would upset me, but for my kid, I would be like, yeah, I don’t know.
Caitlin: And I think there’s a part of you, and this is going to sound bad, but think there’s a part of you that’s like. But I tried to instill these things that I really believe so strongly. And now you’re telling me you believe something completely different. That’s really hard.
Sharon: Which I guess is the same as if you wanted them to go on a mission. They didn’t exactly. It would be exactly feeling. Yes.
Caitlin: So I think you don’t feel bad about it either way. It’s different sides of the same coin, but it would be really hard.
Sharon: Basically, kids just make your life.
Caitlin: Well, thinking of kids making it difficult too. Heather was worried about her daughters getting, bullied because of the book.
Caitlin: And she didn’t know what to do about that. And I wouldn’t know quite what to do about that either, because again, you just wish it was different and you’re trying to give them the tools to deal with something that’s like we were talking with my youngest about, you have to stand up for yourself, not in a fighting way, but you do have to tell people no. You can’t just go, come back home and be like this. So unfair. And this person does this and they say this and their way doesn’t get to be the way. Like, you get to say no to these things. But man, it’s hard as a kid to do that. And I think you’d feel bad as a parent if you were the reason your kid was having to set these boundaries with people and tell them to back off. Her daughters seemed really mature about it, though.
Sharon: They did. But at the same time, the bullying is coming from the group that she doesn’t like.
Caitlin: No, exactly.
Sharon: You know what I mean? I feel like that’s somehow different. It’s not like a random person. It’s like this whole group that’s bullying you. We know that these are the problems.
Caitlin: Yeah. And like she said, it’s not even just a religious thing, it’s a cultural thing, which is interesting. Like that Utah has a very different culture where I grew up in the part of Washington, I went to high school and, we kind of had a similar thing where there was such a huge group of mormonism that it became part of just the culture of ethics and morality and how you behave, that you were aware of that and why people made the choices that they made. And it could be real clicky. And Utah, I’m sure that’s even more fold because the numbers are even higher. So I’d imagine it’s like you feel like you’re sending your kid to automatically be an outcast.
Sharon: Yeah.
Caitlin: And that feels awful.
Sharon: I could see that. But hopefully, I think, like her daughter, her oldest daughter went away to California. I think, especially now that Heather probably has some money, I think she’s going to make sure her kids get out of, like, unless they really want to stay there. So it sucks getting bullied, but. I think they know that they’re on to, I think they don’t want it for themselves.
Caitlin: Right.
Sharon: So they can look past it.
Caitlin: Yeah, exactly. And at least they can kind of see hope in the future. And I think that helps a lot when you’re in a situation that’s uncomfortable and it seems like the girls were reaching out and finding the friends who there’s not everybody is in.
Sharon: Yeah.
Caitlin: Do you think that Lisa’s getting all of the blame for Heather’s Mormon guilt? And do you think once Heather kind of realizes that their friendship flips a little?
Sharon: You know what? As soon as you said the whole thing about, Lisa not quote unquote following the rules, that just makes total sense to me.
Caitlin: I’m still calling it Diet Coke Mormon.
Sharon: I 100% feel like I see their right relationship in a different light now. Yeah, I think that just hit the nail on the head.
Caitlin: M. I mean, I felt like then they kind of turned literally a page at the book reading event.
Sharon: Ha.
Caitlin: because she had Lisa sing, well, rap her intro. I just ordered a Christmas ornament because they were on sale because it’s after Christmas. and it says away in the manger. And then it has Lisa’s picture and then it says Lisa’s version.
Sharon: Nice.
Caitlin: And she did apologize, bringing a ton of Wendy’s food.
Sharon: Yeah.
Caitlin: So you got to give her that. she’s really trying.
Sharon: She is. I’ll accept any apology. Okay.
Caitlin: Just because we haven’t really talked about it anywhere else. And I think this is where it fits in. We need to talk a little bit about the Mormon roots party that Heather has, because the little Bo peep costumes are like my favorite, especially auntie’s. The bonnets, the apron, the Mormon crafts and activities like when they were talking about funeral potatoes, I loved that. It was fun to see the Mormon culture. We’ve seen so much of the negativity about it. Ah, but there is such a beautiful community. As we were saying, what it sucks is being on the outside, but there is like a beautiful wholesomeness to it at times. And community, and the potluck community and the making of the dolls and the churning of the butter. It just felt like we’ve seen Salt Lake for this long and we hadn’t seen that part of it.
Sharon: And.
Caitlin: That was really fun.
Sharon: It was.
Caitlin: Yeah.
Sharon: I really like that. And the churning butter. I just really want to do know, you know?
Caitlin: So I have my grandma’s old butter churn. Like, it’s not really old. It’s like middle old, but you put it in a jar and it’s like a wooden paddle.
Sharon: Oh, yeah.
Caitlin: And you spin it round and around. We do that, but it takes a long time and the kids have to learn patience. It’s, rough, but we could do it.
Sharon: Our kids could not do it. We could do, oh, if you have.
Caitlin: Enough kids and once somebody gets bored, you move on.
Sharon: Or between us, you have six kids.
Caitlin: Exactly. And we could invite.
Sharon: Dedicated, you know. Thomas churned butter in, like, second grade or something in class. They passed it around and he still talks about. Seriously, really good. He has talked about that childhood memory more than. I knew nothing else about his childhood.
Caitlin: We got to make butter.
Sharon: He turned butter.
Caitlin: We should do.
Sharon: And he lived it on our.
Caitlin: This is our butter. The last time we did it, I think I was pregnant with Henry, and I remember it being so good. Now I don’t know if it really.
Sharon: Is or again, no, Thomas, it was amazing.
Caitlin: So we should do it. All right, who wins in, Heather versus Lisa? Yeah. Now that we’ve kind of looked at both ways. I think so too.
Sharon: Wins.
Caitlin: I do think she’s unfairly blend.
Sharon: I think I would feel like Heather does, but I think Lisa wins.
Caitlin: I think so too. I think Lisa wins because I just think she got the blame for guilt that really wasn’t hers. She’s just raising her kid.
Sharon: Exactly.
Caitlin: And she was really honest about raising her kid. So I feel like it’s just unfortunate that all this triggered Heather, but it’s not Lisa’s fault that it triggered Heather. Okay, let’s go into Heather versus Monica. Now we’re going to have a whole Monica episode. So this is just like a little taste of the Heather Monica debacle. we are going to focus on the beauty lab lawsuit.
Sharon: So I don’t know why, but I love lawsuits. Yeah, but, like, regarding stuff like this. Regarding, like, don’t give us one we don’t want. Regarding people not paying businesses.
Caitlin: Yeah, that’s your jam.
Sharon: It’s just. Really? Yeah.
Caitlin: Okay. Mine is copyright infraction, so if you.
Sharon: Watch, there are all the different court shows. Like, Judge Mathis. I used to like it, but it was more about relationships. Like, I sued my ex boyfriend because he gave me $500, and then, like, Judge Millian. What was it, people’s court. A lot of times she did businesses, or judge Judy did businesses, and I liked those.
Caitlin: I played a judge in Miracle on 34th street in high school, and she was like, since you’re a woman playing a judge, she’s like, you’ve got to get the little lace. So I had the judge Judy lace collar. It was amazing. It really does help you make better court decisions.
Sharon: Okay.
Caitlin: Do you think Heather has a right to be hurt the most in this lawsuit? But we’ll get into it. Monica claimed that she had a botched nose and lip injections. What is a nose injection? I want to know.
Sharon: That’s a good. Do you think, like, up here? Both.
Caitlin: I’m wondering for the.
Sharon: What is it called?
Caitlin: Your nose? Crow. It’s not the peak, it’s the valley.
Sharon: The peak is this part, I guess, in between your eyes. In between your eyes.
Caitlin: Okay.
Sharon: Or maybe, like, here, next to your cheek. Yeah, maybe it pulls.
Caitlin: Yeah, maybe you can fake a nose job if you pull it out or squish it in based on the direction you want.
Sharon: I love how we’re making this up. We know nothing about this. We could have at least googled.
Caitlin: Okay, so we’re not going to figure that out, probably during this episode. But Monica claimed they were bots. She didn’t want to pay for them. She’d paid the down payment. She refused to pay others. She also had multiple accounts under different names. I don’t know whether this is her fault or the fact that she has multiple last names. M sometimes a system can really mess you up. Or if someone types your name in wrong.
Sharon: Yeah, you don’t remember which name you used.
Caitlin: I don’t know.
Sharon: When you went in, you’re like, okay, well, this might.
Caitlin: She’s going through a divorce. okay, so I do think. When I was thinking about the whole Monica thing, I do think that Heather has a right to be hurt more than Monica has a right to be.
Sharon: She.
Caitlin: And especially compared to the other women she reached out to Monica the most. They went shopping together before Palm Springs. They bonded over how they’re both bad Mormons. They talked about their moms when they went snowmobiling. And they co host the trip to Bermuda together. And Heather picks Bermuda because of Angie’s connection to.
Sharon: So Monica’s connection.
Caitlin: Oh, because of Monica.
Sharon: Yeah.
Caitlin: I just want to talk about Angie. I really like, understand. I don’t know. Heather was trying so hard.
Caitlin: And then she turns out to be one of the biggest victims in a, of the stuff with Monica.
Sharon: Because does Monica care that she was trying?
Caitlin: I don’t know.
Sharon: I don’t know either.
Caitlin: I can’t decide whether they did connect on that. I do think the mom stuff with Monica is legit.
Sharon: I agree.
Caitlin: So I guess I feel like in that way, there is that connection there.
Sharon: Yeah.
Caitlin: And maybe, Monica hoped that that would carry more weight, maybe when all this came out, but okay, so if.
Sharon: She had this, botched me, part of me is like, why wouldn’t you go to her and say, hey, this didn’t turn out how I wanted. Can you fix it? But then the other part of me is like, well, maybe because they’re newer friends. She feels like. I don’t want to go and insult. I don’t know. What do you think? What would you do?
Caitlin: I feel like this happened more before the show. So I think she didn’t know Heather well then, but there was some discussion about whether she gave beauty lab a chance to fix it. But I don’t know. Sometimes when somebody screws something up, you’re like, you’re not coming at me. I’m done. I made the bad choice. She went to like, they put in quotes, like someone more knowledgeable or something to fix it.
Sharon: I mean, did she make them aware? Like, by the way, you guys, you guys mess this up, so I’m not paying the rest of it.
Caitlin: Because sometimes I’m just kind of like, talk about it.
Sharon: But when they send you a bill, be like, okay, here’s why I’m not paying it or whatever.
Caitlin: Or did she just let it go into default? Because you’re right. She does need to mention.
Sharon: She needs to tell them. M can understand. I can understand. If they really did botch it, I could understand wanting to go somewhere else.
Caitlin: Yes, I completely agree.
Sharon: I want to see it. I need pictures. Receive pictures.
Caitlin: Exactly. No, you’re right.
Sharon: We do need that.
Caitlin: We’ve learned that’s what we need for everything.
Sharon: That’s what we need.
Caitlin: do you think that Heather was trying to use Monica as a replacement.
Sharon: Interesting.
Caitlin: She’s Jen adjacent.
Sharon: You’re right.
Caitlin: They both have the same Jen screwed us over connection.
Sharon: And at the same time, they both are the victims of Jen. But Monica is also kind of. Yeah, tough like Jen.
Caitlin: Sometimes I wonder, does she fill the generals? Monica thought that Heather would see her as, doing something to get Jen Shaw that Heather couldn’t do. Like, she would see her as an angel of rightness. Or like, oh, really? I kind of wonder. And then she was like, oh, really? Everyone’s mad at me. Nobody thought I did a good. Like, I wonder if she kind of.
Sharon: Thought, wait, you’re saying Monica?
Caitlin: Yeah. I kind of wonder if Monica thought that the fact that everyone was so mad at Jen.
Sharon: Uh-huh.
Caitlin: Would make what she did okay.
Sharon: Oh, okay.
Caitlin: And so that’s how she was able to film with everybody. And then when it all blew up, I think she kind of thought it would blow over.
Sharon: I got to think on. Yeah, okay.
Caitlin: And the other issue between the two of them is that Monica and the fact that she complains that she was, sex shamed.
Sharon: Uh-huh.
Caitlin: By Heather, I mean, yes, she was. Heather’s uncomfortable talking about it. Is that really Heather’s fault that she’s uncomfortable talking about it?
Sharon: I think that it could have been ended in, like, one sentence.
Caitlin: I think so, too, because I don’t think it’s like she made a big, huge deal about it. She was just kind of like, I’m not comfortable with it. Yeah, I think they both, again, had issues on both sides.
Sharon: Exactly. I think they both could have just been, like, stopped it right there. And they’re like, okay, whatever. Yeah. Because sometimes you’re just talking, you just say stuff.
Caitlin: The big moment of the season that kind of gave me chills was when Heather and Monica walk on the beach and Monica apologizes about the whole issue that we were just talking about. but this is what I want to know. Do you think that Heather was leading the witness when she says to Monica, is Meredith the one leading the dms? Like, does she have a fake account? What does your gut say? Yeah. Do you think Heather knew more than she let on?
Sharon: Well, she obviously suspected. Interesting.
Caitlin: And then when Monica’s like, well, Meredith wouldn’t, I would be the one who did.
Sharon: Just kidding.
Caitlin: Not me.
Sharon: But I would totally do the same thing as Heather. Oh, I would too, because I want to see. And it’s kind of like you want to catch them if they are lying. You want to see. What will they say?
Caitlin: Exactly?
Sharon: Because then, you know, are you really that bold faced liar? Is it bald faced or bold face? I don’t know.
Caitlin: Oh, I don’t know. Monica has to buy the perfume for the ladies because their cards didn’t work.
Sharon: This is the best thing in the world.
Caitlin: Yeah, it’s foreign, and they didn’t have clearance. Okay, but Heather never paid Angie back. Or not Angie back. Heather had Angie maybe pay wouldn’t have. Would you have paid her back for the perfume knowing that she was suing your mean. I guess we’re getting two shoes. We probably would.
Sharon: I probably would just.
Caitlin: Well, you wouldn’t because you don’t believe in Venmo.
Sharon: I don’t believe in Venmo. She’s absolutely right.
Caitlin: She’s like, you can come to my house and get a check.
Sharon: yeah, exactly. I would mail. Mail a check. I’m not creating a password for you. I would not create a password. She’ll create one for me if I.
Caitlin: Won’T create one for Caitlin.
Sharon: I’m not creating, but I kind of think I would, just so I could stand and be righteous about, like, you owe me money. It gives her an opportunity to be like, well, you didn’t pay me for this. You’re right.
Caitlin: It does kind of set her up in a bad way.
Sharon: Yeah. I don’t want to throw it in her face, so I do.
Caitlin: Totally hilarious that she does.
Sharon: What was it? I remember reading all these memes about making fun of Monica’s bank card or so. I don’t know what the deal was. I don’t even know what it was.
Caitlin: Don’t know what it was.
Sharon: But everyone was just.
Caitlin: Everyone was just. I think it was just the fact that we were talking about all of this, and then all of a sudden, it’s like, here she is pulling out her card. No one else’s card is working. And then it was, like, almost. And, like, I was actually panicked for her in that moment.
Sharon: So embarrassing.
Caitlin: But it was just like, I can’t watch.
Sharon: What is the. It was so cringey because they just.
Caitlin: Had said things about her at that point. The money with Lisa and all of that. It’s like, I don’t know. we’ll talk about it more, of course, in the Monica episode. But, like, the Bermuda and the OG beach scene is brilliant. And I think just because it’s her episode, we need to say Heather played it brilliantly.
Sharon: She did.
Caitlin: Like, we don’t just talk about how we feel about it, but I think we just need to talk about how iconic it is. Heather set it up. She made the choices. She set up the dinner, but she still chose to have the pregame on the beach. The weather was not her fault, but that was still brilliant.
Sharon: Yeah.
Caitlin: And then her receipts, proof screenshots. I mean, it proves why she has her job.
Sharon: Yes.
Caitlin: And it proves why her book is good. She knows what she’s doing.
Sharon: She does. She is. She’s smart.
Caitlin: She is. Yeah. Okay, so who wins in the beauty lab debate? Nothing has come to a head yet. Yeah, we know Heather discovered it when she went to buy gift cards and discovered the multiple names.
Caitlin: And then sort of talked through it with her hairdresser and everything.
Sharon: I would assume Heather.
Caitlin: What do you mean?
Sharon: I guess Monica hasn’t paid.
Caitlin: Yeah.
Sharon: However she looks, she already is talking about how she’s like poor and she’s broke.
Sharon: But she doesn’t want to be seen that way. But then she’s also like defaulting on this beauty lab.
Caitlin: And that’s the thing. I think legally I’m sure that Monica is in the wrong. And I think she is in the wrong at the same time. You do have to pay your bills whether you like it or not. Sometimes I’ve paid something. Like when you get a hospital bill and you’re not totally sure and you’re like, well, I will pay it. And then I need to talk to them about it because I don’t want it to sit in default. You can’t just sit there and not pay something because you didn’t like how it worked. There’s steps. And she did need to document it and she did need to go through it. And then knowing that she’s on a public show, like she is dragging Heather through a public thing.
Sharon: Good point.
Caitlin: And that would make me a little mad if I was Heather.
Sharon: But why isn’t she putting out, like, pictures of how bad it was?
Caitlin: I don’t know. Maybe it wasn’t that bad.
Sharon: Especially now that Heather doesn’t like her anymore. I.
Caitlin: Pictures trump all the other pictures.
Sharon: Okay. And they thought that was a beauty.
Caitlin: Yeah.
Sharon: Remember?
Caitlin: They were like.
Sharon: It was like Fox.
Caitlin: See, they’re just so mean of us.
Sharon: Everyone’s out for beauty lab.
Caitlin: They are.
Sharon: We need a beauty lab here because I really want Botox. I have this line. I’ve never had Botox before, but I’ve got this line and I want it to go away. I know, it’s so sad. So I don’t know where to go.
Caitlin: I don’t either.
Sharon: If there was a beauty lab, I would call it beauty lab and I would be in there.
Caitlin: I feel like there is something about a niche thing like that. It’s like when we got our ears pierced at Bravocon.
Sharon: It’s called studs. Exactly.
Caitlin: It’s like, you know what they do? They give you all the choices. Like, it makes it so much easier versus trying to find somebody and they’re in a shop, and maybe they do it, maybe they don’t do it. How long do you have to wait and where do you go? It’s like, you do kind of just want all of that there. Like, ah, a self laid out thing.
Sharon: Like, we need, like, expand Botox. What’s m the name for a store that starts with A-B-I don’t know. Botox boutique. Yeah, exactly. Except I can’t go places that use its letters.
Caitlin: Oh, that’s right.
Sharon: Nothing with a U. Nothing with the number four.
Caitlin: No number four botox for you with the letter u.
Sharon: No coupons.
Caitlin: You’re going to be suing them. All right, let’s talk about Heather versus the black eye. So at the beginning of the season, Heather says with Jen in prison, she feels like a door is closed and she can move on. And then we get to the reunion, and we’re still talking about the black eye. So on April 9 of 2022, Heather woke up with a black eye. And now she’s saying, after all of this back and forth, and was it the sink and was it the faucet and was it a robber who came out of nowhere? We didn’t know. She’s saying, jen did it, but here’s. Did she know from the beginning Jen did it, or did she unpack that?
Sharon: This is still unclear to me. This is what I don’t like. So she says, jen did it.
Caitlin: It feels like one of those false confessions.
Sharon: Ah.
Caitlin: You know when they say so much stuff that you’re like, no, now I remember it.
Sharon: Uh-huh.
Caitlin: That’s how I feel about this.
Sharon: Because then she says, like, I’ll cover. She didn’t say, like, jen punched me in the face.
Caitlin: Yeah.
Sharon: Jen got mad at me and punched me. She didn’t say that?
Caitlin: No.
Sharon: Was it an accident?
Caitlin: That’s why.
Sharon: Because, she could have accidentally. It’s really easy to elbow someone, or they were wrestling around, playing. She could have easily.
Caitlin: Because they were being weird. Yeah.
Sharon: They were like, yeah. So I still don’t understand if it.
Caitlin: Was an accident or legitimately assault. I feel like it was an accident or she would have said it.
Sharon: But really, see, I feel like she was making it sound like it was an assault.
Caitlin: But she does make it sound so much worse.
Sharon: Because why wouldn’t you say if it was an accident, why would you feel.
Caitlin: That she’s just made this whole thing worse.
Sharon: Why would you feel so scared about it if it was an accident?
Caitlin: I know, because Heather says I was scared of her. I was covering for her for three years. Why stop covering for an accident?
Sharon: You’re like, okay, it was an accident.
Caitlin: You could just be like, you’re right, this does look bad for you. We don’t need to talk about then. But then that’s what you say to the thing. Jen and I talked about it and she was going through so much stuff and I was her friend and I wasn’t really hurt, so I just didn’t want to make it a thing. But she still makes it a thing. It won’t stop being a didn’t.
Sharon: So at first I was kind of on Heather’s head when she was coming up with different things. But then when Andy said you blamed production and that’s people’s actually, I was like, oh my God, you’re. That you don’t remember. That is someone like, that’s their job. They go to work every day. Can you imagine if you went to work and something was unfairly blamed on you? That would be very upsetting.
Caitlin: And it’s interesting when he says, how is this completely different from what Monica did to you? I mean, there’s differences, but you told a lie and carried it through with production and everything to more than a season. And now there’s like no grace and no room for us to forgive Monica. Which I do think is interesting.
Sharon: I think because she’s the victim. You give her a little more leeway to make mistakes. But however she kept, she did.
Caitlin: She blamed someone.
Sharon: She brought other people down with her when she didn’t have to.
Caitlin: And it’s also interesting her narrating that they do have footage, but the footage is inaudible. But again, I thought they were going to have footage of Jen’s elbow. They were like, here it. I. Yeah, I was trying to demonstrate and I almost took out all of our recordings. That’s how dramatic it is. but I thought that’s what they’d have footage of. And instead they had footage of what Heather is saying. She and Jen talking about the COVID up.
Sharon: Yeah.
Caitlin: So then it was like them narrating like a really bad. And then Jen said. And then I said. And then I said this. And again, I don’t like Jen Shaw. And I’m sure she did it. But, allegedly. I’m sure she allegedly did. I don’t want to get sued.
Sharon: Okay?
Caitlin: But, Jen Shaw can’t afford her.
Sharon: Lawyer to sue you. Okay.
Caitlin: You think? But she’s got friends now.
Sharon: Oh, that’s true. She’s friends with Elizabeth Holmes, right?
Caitlin: Exactly.
Sharon: Shalakhomes.
Caitlin: Shalakholmes. And this might be the first case.
Sharon: So I don’t want to be on.
Caitlin: The other side of.
Sharon: Elizabeth Holmes has crazy eyes.
Caitlin: That’s what I’m saying. You can tell even through the prison picture. But I don’t think it’s fair for Heather to narrate this. And then we use that as, like, I mean, she’s not under oath. It’s just sort of weird for her to get to sit there and narrate this narrationless scene and explain that. Oh, by the way, this does explain everything.
Sharon: Does it?
Caitlin: Or were they sitting there talking about the hot gossip from the night before? We don’t know, and I’m not sure that’s fair.
Sharon: You’re right.
Caitlin: Evidence.
Sharon: You’re right. I didn’t even think of that.
Caitlin: I don’t like that.
Sharon: I hate it when we have to be nice to gentle, but we do.
Caitlin: Not say negative to follow.
Sharon: No, but it’s true. And we should have equal standards.
Caitlin: And, I mean, I get when Whitney kind of says that Heather had Stockholm syndrome and that they all kind of did, but I don’t understand why Jen wasn’t at the first reunion either. I just don’t understand why it couldn’t have been cleared up or if you’re going to go in with this, maybe you didn’t need to bring it up at the dinner.
Sharon: Why didn’t she bring it up at the dinner? It’s almost like I think she had it in her and she wanted to.
Caitlin: Say it so badly and everything was a mess there anyway. Might as well just.
Sharon: Do you think she wanted to do it for most dramatic impact or that was just her emotion because she was talking about basically being betrayed?
Caitlin: I think it was her emotion because.
Sharon: She was betrayed by Monica and then she was betrayed by Jen. And she’s like, I’m not going to hide what you did now. Like I did for Jen.
Caitlin: Exactly. That’s what I think it was like. I’ve learned my lesson and I’m not going to do the same thing again. But it is interesting because it was such, all the other women on the cast were like, jaw drop.
Sharon: Yeah.
Caitlin: So I don’t know. Are we as understanding as the rest of the cast was? Like, as we’re talking about, like, know it was Stockholm. And Lisa says Heather seemed broken, and Meredith said she understood.
Sharon: Yes and no.
Caitlin: Yes.
Sharon: I understand. I can understand being fearful that Jen Shaw will go on some all out, like, online attack war against me and make my life miserable.
Caitlin: Is upset about this coming out.
Sharon: So for that reason, especially, Heather’s, like, she’s sensitive to getting harassed online. I, can see her being kind of scared, but Heather is.
Caitlin: I would have been scared of have.
Sharon: Because you and I don’t like confrontation. I don’t think Heather’s has find weird about it.
Caitlin: Yeah.
Sharon: I mean, her book is the ultimate confrontation.
Caitlin: Yeah. I’m surprised she didn’t drop that info in the book.
Sharon: You’re right.
Caitlin: I would have sold a lot more books.
Sharon: Interesting.
Caitlin: Yeah. Do you feel any resolution in this? Because I don’t.
Sharon: No.
Caitlin: Yeah.
Sharon: Not at all.
Caitlin: Was it a surprise that it came up with a reunion a little bit? I kind of thought we were done with it.
Sharon: Yeah.
Caitlin: But then they sort of teased season. It was a reality von Teaser, if you will.
Sharon: Okay, well, I just love the name reality von Teaser. I do.
Caitlin: It’s great. Okay, so who wins? Who wins in Monica versus Heather the Blackhawk? I mean, Heather. Monica doesn’t win in any of this, and she doesn’t win as the season comes out, and we’ll deal with her later.
Sharon: So Heather won everything except Lisa and.
Caitlin: The ability to control her espresso martinis. She did not win that either.
Sharon: Oh, where she peed.
Caitlin: Yeah, that was her emotional support beverage. What’s your emotional support beverage?
Sharon: diet Dr. Pepper or coffee?
Caitlin: Coke. Sitting in front of us right now. Yeah, I can’t decide. I was trying to think because, my answer is Diet coke. If someone’s just going to hand me anything, it’s a diet coke. But when coffee is at that perfect temperature of warmth and it has just, like, a little bit of cream in it, there’s something that resets my whole soul.
Sharon: Yes. Okay. I saw this sign once, and it was like that first sip feeling, and I was like, oh, my God. So when I go their coffee shop, in the hospital that I work at, so I go, and then I take that sip, and I’m like, it is. It’s amazing. And you can never get it. Even if you microwave it, you can’t get it back to that.
Caitlin: No. I keep thinking maybe we need to invest in one of those really fancy coffee machines and then bring it with us to Bravocon because they have to work out the coffee situation before next year. I’m not playing that game again.
Sharon: I’m bringing everyone in. Tons of, like, Starbucks via.
Caitlin: Exactly.
Sharon: A little water, a little thermo, maybe.
Caitlin: Actually, that’s not a bad idea. Yeah, I don’t see. It’s just water. They’ll let you have water.
Sharon: Why can’t you have hot water? You know how you feel? Excluded. I feel like I was different from everyone. I felt like they didn’t understand me.
Caitlin: They didn’t?
Sharon: No.
Caitlin: Remember we kept trying to say to.
Sharon: People looked at us and people were.
Caitlin: Like, it’s like they didn’t care that they didn’t have coffee. Guys, we were going to storm the castle.
Sharon: Where are you from? Clearly not Washington.
Caitlin: coffee.
Sharon: I never felt so washingtonian in my life.
Caitlin: See, this is why we need a real housewives of, like, Seattle. We need them to get really upset about the coffee.
Sharon: And they should be like. And the rain and the farmed salmon.
Caitlin: Ah, exactly.
Sharon: I’m not eating this.
Caitlin: I want to see this.
Sharon: I do, too.
Caitlin: It would make my heart so. All right, well, that is our Heather episode. Whether she’s a good housewife or a bad housewife. We’ll see what the book, the next book says is. I wonder what the timeline is on her getting the book out, too.
Sharon: Oh, so is she actually writing another one?
Caitlin: She was telling the girls that she would. Her kids on the right, and I bet they would. It sold so well. I bet they’ll give her one.
Sharon: I’d buy it, but it’s hard because.
Caitlin: She wrote about a lot of her have to. It would be a lot of the.
Sharon: Current stuff, I guess that might even be better.
Caitlin: Or a cookbook. With the funeral, every celebrity gets a cookbook. It’s like, Teresa gets a cookbook, but.
Sharon: Hers are actually good.
Caitlin: Yeah, hers are actually good. I bet Heather’s would be good. I mean, that Mormon fair. Yeah, but I don’t know if they let you send those receipts out.
Sharon: They don’t let you have those recipes. Once you leave the community, you don’t get the recipes.
Caitlin: I can’t say recipe now. Receipts is just so ingrained in my brain. All right, well, remember, housewives bring the.
Sharon: Drama, but we bring the receipts. Prove timeline, screenshots.
Caitlin: Bye bye.
Sharon: Thanks for listening. If you enjoyed this episode, please hit the subscribe button. If you’d like to help support us, please share it with others and leave a rating and review. Also visit us on Instagram and Twitter, both at RH for fun Pictures and polls. Or email us, ah, at rhonrhpodcast at, uh@gmail.com, thanks again. And remember to stay out of the shade.